Forums >> Revit Building >> Technical Support >> Building Nest Families - Separate Doors and Frames

VonBraun

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Joined: Mon, Jun 10, 2013
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Hello All

I need some guidence as I have been spinning my wheels here abit.

Revit Version:  Revit 2014 and Revit LT 2014

Goal: To build door families that allow me to separate the frame from the door panel, change the door panel inside the frame and schedule both enitites in one schedule.

Request: I need some guidence on how to proceed. I'm not sure if I don't understand shared parameters or shared families or if my general methodolgy is right.

What I have done:

I started with a door family, modeled a simple frame as a test. Then created a series of door panels (started as generic models then changed the family cateorgy to door), all from the same intial set up and nested the first one inside the host door family. Alinged and locked it. I was able to model these and change the door panels with a "Family Type" parameter (without aligning and locking each one) and tie them together. Hence when the host family (frame) size changes the panel parametrically also changes with it. This worked fine untill I want to schedule everything. I decided to try and keep things simple in that I'll separate my hosts by frame types as opposed to nesting the frames and the door panels. This is something I have read that people try but seemed to me to over complicate individual families. 

Troubles:

When I try to schedule things I don't have a type mark for the door panels. I got the idea of making the door panel a shared family, which then for some reason I can no longer drive its geometry from the host family.

Scheduling is also still a problem because I'm not sure what information to take from each family. I was trying to make it simple and take as much info as I could from the host family. Then only get a "type mark" for the door panel from that nested family. I was thinking to make a custom shared parameter in the panel family for this function. I couldn't seem to get it to work.

The other problem I'm running into is the "to" and "from" room parameter, as it is not stable with nested families. I need to do that from the host family, because if I activate that parameter in the nested family, it doesn't translate to the host and into the project. But if I put in in the host and flip the door more then twice I suddenly lose it and in my schedule I have empty voids in the fields.

So can I get some advice here and if I'm being a nob tell me what I need to research, I just don't know which direction to go. I end up solving once problem only to create another. I also have a feeling I'm mixing shared families and shared parameters when I shouldn't be. Just not sure exactly which procress to use.  

Thanks in advance and I appreciate any advice I can get.

See the attached files for my progress. There is also an example of the schedule I'm looking to generate. Granted it is actually two separate schedules that are placed together on a sheet. I'd like to avoid this if I can, and create only a single schedule with all the info. I need this simple enough for the office template. 

Regards

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WWHub

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Joined: Tue, May 16, 2006
13079 Posts

I think you are a bit over-ambitious ... you needed more background before you started this..... BTW - We all do this.

You really need a thorough understanding of families before you can achieve what you want.  Start by downloading the families guide here:

http://revit.downloads.autodesk.com/download/RAC2009/Families_Guide/ENU/Family_Guide/PDF/ArchitectureFamiliesImpENU.pdf

Don't worry that it says 2009.  Almost 100% of this is still applicable.  Read and study this before you go any furthur.

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VonBraun

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Thanks, I guess.

You can't even be alittle more specific? Like "read up on shared parameters" or something? I know I have a knowledge gap but I don't have time to learn everything from an 800 page guide before I start. That's why we have forums!

I know people are doing this so I'd appreciate a more precise suggestion.

Boss wants separate frames from doors, how do I do this and schedule them?

Thanks

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WWHub

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Joined: Tue, May 16, 2006
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Scan through the guide and you will see the applicable segments.  In the meantime, here are some pointers:

• Door families will all schedule as doors.   Is that really what you want ?
• Nested families CAN be controlled by the host but not by instance variables - only type.
• In order to schedule parameters, they must be shared.
• We always schedule the frames and thepanels in the door schedule but we do that using type parameters - not seperate familes.  The type parameter controls symbollic lines and model elements.   Really a better way to go!

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VonBraun

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Thanks Hub those are useful directions

I've realize I'm getting hung up on linking instance parameters.

1) For my schedules if the nested family is not shared, even it is is a panel set as a "door family" category it won't schedule

2) Nested families unshared = type parameters

Shared families  = instance parameters (Is this true? Can I drive my nested family from my host family if all parameters are shared and instance based? If yes, do I also have to set the nested panel family to be shared?)

3) I'm relying on the host family OOTB parameters for schedules, or creating shared parameters for things I'm lacking or unhappy with, for example a "fire rating parameter that is instance based." I created a shared parameter too for Frame Type, even though it is still in the OOTB template. (I can't edit that one, wanted a type parameter) The Host family is the frame but I use it for the type mark for the "Door" type D(whatever) and the frame type is typed in as the a shared text parameter . 

4) How does a type parameter control model and symbolic elements? Is that in the guide? I have not tried to do that.

Seems there are so many ways to do doors I was drowning in possibilities. I was also trying to combine types of parameters that I didn't realize don't play nice with eachother, like instance and type. Hence getting lost.

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WWHub

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Joined: Tue, May 16, 2006
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Read these sections in the families guide.

Attached Images

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Door Families with HM frames that center on walls.

0

New 2016 Architectural Doors

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Is it possible to separate metal and glass doors swing color in floor plan?

3

Building Curtain Wall Doors

3

Nested Door Families and Door Schedules

3