Forums >> Revit Building >> Technical Support >> Overall Plans and Partial Plans ... looking for Best Practice

iamian33

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Greetings.

I am prepaing plans, views and sheets for a floor plan that is too large for the D size sheet.  I need to have 4 partial plans at 1:100 and an overall plan at 1:250 showing a simplified view of the plan, with 'something' pointing to the partial plans. 

I don't know what is the better approach:

1. dependant views (1:100) w/ matchlines and a separate overall plan (1:250), or
2. an overall plan with callouts to create the partial plans (independent views)

Since the matchline doesn't indicate the dependent view being called, and the parent view needs to be the same scale as the dependent views, I was hoping that the reference callout in an independent overall plan (1:250) would allow a reference to a dependent view, but it will not.  I like the control of the parent/dependent view, but if I cannot use the reference callout, I am stuck. 

What is the 'Best Practice' to setup views with an overall plan (1:250), partial plans (1:100), a matchline and details keys that indicate the location of the partial plan?  If any of you guru's out there can share your experience, I'd be very greatful. 

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Ian Shafer

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True North S&F Consultants

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rkitect

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We actually had a pretty good debate about this not too long ago in the chat room.  If you look at the National CAD Standards, you have an overall plan (independent view) that is at a scale to fit on a sheet.  You then have as many partial plans at a scale that gets the information you need on a sheet.  On these partial plans (dependent views) use a small scale keyplan to indicate their location in the project and matchlines to indicate where to go from there.

HTH,  

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Carl - rkitecsure[at]gmail.com

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You fell victim to one of the classic blunders. The most famous is never get involved in a land war in asia, but only slightly less well known is this! Never go in against a Sicilian when death is on the line!

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iamian33

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HTH

Thank you for your response.  This is what I am planning to do, but I would feel more comfortable with the ability to have a 'callout' to direct the contractor to the enlarged plan.  I realize that this is not necessary, a key plan will work, but my boss wants a 'callout' ... and he signs the drawings ... (and cheque) 

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Ian Shafer

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True North S&F Consultants

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WWHub

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iamian33

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WW

Not so sure why you chose to respond if you don't have any positive suggestion.  But to answer your question ...

I have a few options to proceed with the overall / partial plan scenario.  I came to this particular plan after further thought (and after the post), but I wanted to see if anyone else had a better idea, or a negative experience with this particular path. 

Revit has so many undocumented secrets and is often vague on certain facilities, like Matchline.  Matchline has some great potential, but seems to only be a 'line' that can be extended to or limited to particular views.  Unless I'm missing something ...

Where as, the dependent view scenario is quite powerful and I find it very useful.  I would like to be able to have a Relative Callout 'point' to a dependent view, but I guess I can't have everything. 

Also, I didn't want to assume that I would always know the best way to proceed.  Isn't that the purpose of this forum?  A place to share our experience, strength and ... wishlist?

Have a lovely day. (sincerely)Ian

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Ian Shafer

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rkitect

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I would point your boss towards National CAD Standards and ask why not just conform with that since that's what contractors are being taught in Construction Management school.  The matchline tool is pretty well documented in how it is meant to be used in Revit and matches this convention to a 'T.'  I'm not sure what you mean by a "relative" callout, but you can modify a callout tag to look however you want it to, however callouts were never intended to be used for use as partial plan locating devices, but instead to point to areas that require more detail or attention than the conventional sized plan allows for.

HTH! 

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Carl - rkitecsure[at]gmail.com

Need help? I'm probably in my chat room!

You fell victim to one of the classic blunders. The most famous is never get involved in a land war in asia, but only slightly less well known is this! Never go in against a Sicilian when death is on the line!

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brettgoodchild

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My two cents on this topic if I may.

We have two projects going right now where we decided to test out the thoughts of process from the OP.

The first project is doing what a lot of resellers recommend and that is using a simple floor plan callout to create the sector plans.

The second is utilizing the parent / child views and matchline.

In my opinion, the floor plan callout was not really meant for making sector views...don't get me wrong, it handles this quite nicely, but I feel its purpose is for creating enlarged plans (Comm rooms, kitchens, etc.) and let the keyplan tell you what sector you are in.  This works, but when you have a large building with say 9 different sectors, your drawings get bogged down (graphically) with all the callouts.

The project that is using the dependant views is actually working quite nice. The biggest downfall I hear is "...the parent view has to be the same scale and cannot be independently annotated?!?"

Consider the aforementioned method and what it entails.

You make a floor plan view and then add callouts making sector plans...so you get a independent composite view and an independent sector view... or one composite model view and a model view per sector. If you utilize the dependent viesw method, that really doesn't change.

Here is how we manage this. We have a composite view that is completely indenpendent from any views that we eventually turn into a documentation view (sheet view.) This part is no different from the first process as it yeilds ONE composite view.

We duplicate that composite views and apply dependants. The newly duplicated "composite" view is what we actually use as a working view for the sector plans. It allows us to annotate and detail while seeing the entire plan if necessary. The dependant views are then placed on sheets and never touched after that. Thus, we actually have as many views to work on that the original method does. The key to making this work is having a well structured project browser!!

This part is really not different from the first process as it can yeild one view per sector.

As for the OP about a "reference callout" ... if I understand you correctly, the view reference should suffice?

HTH

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Sherazyarchi

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This is very old thread but it talks about an issue I am searching for. I hope the participants here receive this reply and advise on it.

@rkitect; I duplicated a view (Ground floor plan) two times to divide it into two partial plan views. When I changed the scale of the created partial views the scale of the original master view changed as well. I overcame this issue by making an independent duplication of the master view first, then duplicate it dependently two times to get the two partial views. 

Thus, I have 2 master views; one in a 1:100 scale (the original ground floor view) and the other is in 1:50 scale (independent - parent of the partials), in addition to two partial view in 1:50 scale (dependent). The problem now is that any details I need to add to the ground floor view, I have to add it to the duplicated view as well, which is the parent of the partials, to avoid conflict. This is confusing and could cause problems if I forget to add any future details twice. How to control this? Or any other solution?

I have attached an image of the concerned views captured from the project browser for clarification.

I hope I have clearly explained the issue and I get reply from the participants here. 

Thank you and sorry for the lengthening.

Attached Images

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WWHub

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Dependent views are just that .... dependent.

You only need to create two views.

1. Create an overall plan at the correct scale (can be duplicate but not dependent).   This will have all annotations and will be 1/2 your building eventually.
2. Place your MATCH-LINE
3. Set up the crop region for this first plan.
4. Create a dependent view of this first plan and set the crop region for the second half. (Make sure the crops overlap.)
5. Now place these views on seperate sheets.
6. Add a view reference at the matchline to point to each sheet.

Here is a tutorial: http://www.revitzone.com/presentation-and-graphics/168-matchlines

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Sherazyarchi

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Thank you WWHub for your quick response. I believe I followed the same procedure you recommended except that for 2 partials you have made only ONE independent duplication and ONE dependent duplication, while I made ONE independent duplication (work as a master view) and TWO dependent duplications (1 duplicate for each partial view).

The main question is about the details I may place in the original plan after creating the duplication such as annotations. How to reflect them in the independent duplicate? Should I add any details two times from now on? i.e. one time in the original plan view and another time in the independent duplicate? this may cause conflicts or mistakes. Right? If yes, so how to control that? Just need I to be careful and concentrating to avoid missing details in the independent duplicate?

Thank you

Sherazy 

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WWHub

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You are right in not wanting to maintain two sets of plans.  Our small scale, overall views were never meant to show all the information, just overall layout, rooms and dimensions.  The small scale plans should have some sort of notation to refer to the larger scale plans which have the details and notes.

BTW - Your match-line tag is automatic in Revit to show the correct sheet reference for each side of the match-line.

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Sherazyarchi

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It makes a lot of sense. Thanks WWhub for your great help. I appreciate it.

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Sherazyarchi

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Hi again WWHub. It seems that this topic has not been closed yet for me

Coming to the practical application of what we discussed 2 weeks ago, I need to place a view reference for the big scale partial views on the small scale master view. I have two partial views, one to the left side and one to the right. The view reference of each side is shown correctly on the view of the other one. However, I am not able to place the correct references on the master view (the small scale drawing) which is supposed to be the key that show the references that guide reviewers to the sheet numbers of both partial views. Please see the attachments.

How to show the references in the master drawing? 

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Sherazyarchi

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I have realized that while placing a view reference for the partials on the original view shows nothing since they are not dependent to it, I am able to copy the view references placed on the partials to the original view and they are linked to them and working well.

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WWHub

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You should be using "Reference Other View"

http://help.autodesk.com/view/RVT/2016/ENU/?caas=caas%2Fscreencast%2FMain%2FDetails%2F31b698a1-0b25-4877-9f86-9884f8ea66e8.html

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